Today, we're joined by Raullen Chai, Co-Founder and CEO of IoTeX, a Ph.D. in cryptography from the University of Waterloo and former engineering leadership roles at Google, Uber, and Oracle. He champions the vision of DePIN—decentralized physical infrastructure networks—that bridge real‑world IoT devices and blockchain to empower users with ownership of their data and infrastructure.
Chris: “DePIN for Everyone” is a bold statement. How do you define “everyone” in this context — is it developers, enterprises, consumers, or all of the above? And how does IoTeX 2.0 bridge the gap between these groups?
Raullen: When we say “DePIN for everyone,” we truly mean everyone—builders, users, and even infrastructure contributors who might not even realize they’re part of a DePIN yet. Developers need intuitive tools and composable infrastructure. Enterprises need trusted data flows and cost efficiency. Everyday users just want things that work and give them value.
IoTeX 2.0 was designed to unify those layers: our modular stack makes it easy for devs to spin up new DePINs, while things like W3bstream, ioID, and token primitives abstract away complexity for end users. We’re bridging gaps with real tooling, not just whitepapers.
Chris: IoTeX 2.0 aims to onboard 100 million devices in the next 3–5 years. What’s your roadmap to reaching that number, and what role does community or grassroots adoption play?
Raullen: That number isn’t just aspirational—it’s grounded in what we’re already seeing. We have hardware partners shipping IoTeX-enabled devices, and community-led DePINs like DIMO and GEODNET gaining real traction.
The roadmap includes expanding developer onboarding with QuickSilver, scaling middleware like W3bstream, and partnering with device manufacturers at the chip level. But grassroots plays a huge role—many of the most successful DePINs today started with passionate communities. We’re empowering those networks with the tools and incentives to scale.
Chris: You describe nine essential layers in the DePIN reference architecture. Which of these layers do you think is the most underestimated or misunderstood by the wider developer community — and why?
Raullen: I’d say the “Identity” layer is the most overlooked, yet it’s absolutely foundational. Without a reliable way to identify machines—securely, verifiably, and interoperably—you can’t build trust in decentralized physical systems.
Most devs are used to user wallets, not machine wallets. ioID changes that by giving devices a secure, programmable identity they carry through their lifecycle. It’s a paradigm shift for how we think about trust in DePINs.
Chris: How does W3bstream differ from general-purpose off-chain compute solutions like zkSync or Cartesi? What unique advantage does it bring specifically to DePINs?
Raullen: zkSync and Cartesi are excellent for general-purpose compute and scaling, but they’re not built with physical-world inputs in mind. W3bstream is purpose-built for DePINs—it’s optimized for verifiable real-world data ingestion, not just compute.
We designed it to handle messy, off-chain signals like sensor data, geolocation, or device state—and produce ZK-proofs or attestations that DePINs can trust. It’s the glue between physical and digital worlds.
Chris: With ioID, you’re introducing NFT-bound smart contract wallets for machines. This is a huge leap. How do you handle lifecycle events — like hardware replacement or identity migration — while maintaining trust?
Raullen: That’s a great question because lifecycle integrity is a real challenge. With ioID, identity is tied to both a secure enclave on the hardware side and an NFT on-chain. When a device retires, we support identity migration flows—think of it like a device transferring its role or credential to a new instance, governed by a programmable policy.
Because everything is on-chain and verifiable, you retain an auditable trail that proves continuity. It’s all about composable trust.
Chris: Crypto’s Got Talent (CGT) is an unconventional but brilliant idea. How do you measure the success of a CGT winner long-term, beyond funding or initial exposure?
Raullen: Success isn’t about short-term hype. We look at whether CGT winners go on to ship real products, build engaged communities, and meaningfully grow the DePIN category.
Did their idea attract developers? Did their protocol onboard users or devices? Did it unlock something new in the ecosystem? That’s what we track. Funding is just the start—we want to back long-term builders.
Chris: For developers used to EVM and Ethereum tooling, what surprises them most when they build on IoTeX?
Raullen: A lot of devs are surprised by how tightly integrated our infrastructure is with the physical world. They come in expecting another EVM chain—but quickly realize IoTeX gives them native tools for device identity, data attestation, and real-world automation.
Also, our developer onboarding through QuickSilver feels much more “full-stack”—we give you the tools to go from idea to deployed DePIN a lot faster than people expect.
Chris: Can you elaborate on the DePIN section for builders and the practical demos you provide? Specifically, how do these demos help developers get started with creating their own wireless, sensor, or energy DePIN networks?
Raullen: We’re big believers in showing, not just telling. Our demo flows walk builders through the whole process: creating a machine identity with ioID, streaming data with W3bstream, setting up token incentives, and even visualizing proof of real-world activity.
It’s like an IDE for DePIN. Whether you’re building a Helium-style wireless network or a solar sensor grid, we want devs to get hands-on and realize they don’t need to reinvent the wheel.
Chris: What are the next major innovations or protocols you’re planning to introduce on the IoTeX platform over the next 12–18 months?
Raullen: QuickSilver will be a big focus—it’s evolving into a full open-source DePIN x AI framework, enabling use cases like AI agents that operate on real-time physical data.
We’re also expanding support for cross-chain DePIN deployments, enhancing W3bstream’s performance layer, and rolling out more DAO-driven incentives through our DePIN + AI Reserve.
Expect more composability, more developer grants, and a growing suite of open tools.
Chris: Lastly, in a world where many blockchain projects pivot often, what will IoTeX never compromise on, no matter how the market shifts?
Raullen: We’ll never compromise on building for real-world impact. That means staying grounded in user-owned infrastructure, data sovereignty, and practical utility.
Trends will come and go—L2s, NFTs, AI cycles—but the need for trustworthy infrastructure that connects the digital and physical worlds isn’t going anywhere. That’s our north star.
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